WRX Motorsport 2018

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DANS-14
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby DANS-14 » Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:50 am

Thanks Kurt, glad to see this changed for a scenario you guys maybe didn't foresee that clearly was an issue, and that's going to happen with such a wide array of cars and mods.

Assuming your 'parity' point was directed at me, I was not implying we need a 'daily' that is 40 points away from a 'track' car to be on par for example, I'm talking about a daily and track car on similar points. Not everyone can have a track car for varying reasons like cost and/or 'fun police', but that doesn't mean they aren't there to compete and don't want to win as much as the next guy. Yes there are those that want to just have some fun, and that's ok too.

Kyle, not sure how the Clubman winner can worry about being competitive ;) Its always been your choice of where you want to 'spend' your points and people can choose which class they want to play in for those reasons. Having said that, I'd love to see you, Blotto and Naccas (to name a few) fighting it out if u can get some numbers...

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Lostprophet
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby Lostprophet » Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:54 pm

Exciting to see these changes come through. Thanks to the team for looking into it.
-----Autobots transform and roll out-----
Street Class
Sandown 1:30.43 (23/04/2017)
Calder Park 1:12.26 (20/09/2014)
Phillip Island 2:00.09 (02/07/2017)
Broadford 1:10.41 (24/09/2017)

Pleiades
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby Pleiades » Mon Dec 04, 2017 11:14 pm

I have been very interested in watching this style of points based classes develop since it was introduced.
Though its introduction caused a bit of a stir at the time ;-(

But it was much more transparent and easy to understand that the previous system.

The comment someone made earlier about it allowing people to spend their points where they want is the main thing.
It allows people to push/ experiment with what they think works best.
The restrictor pill thing only partially works, you also need to lock down the turbo to a sealed oem and sealed ecu. Then someone will still find a way around. It is amazing what has been tried, like roll cages used as auxiliary fuel tanks.

If you want to actually race, join IPRA or Sedans.
( see other thread)
Inventing you own race class is reinventing the wheel, plus races can only be had on race permitted days at the tracks. They are all taken. You would have to buy a slot at one of them, you would need 20 entrants to afford it. Ask VicV8!

Anyway, if you think doing classes for a one make series is hard come a help me do it for a series with 40 different possibilies


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h-are
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby h-are » Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:00 am

Pleiades wrote:I have been very interested in watching this style of points based classes develop since it was introduced.
Though its introduction caused a bit of a stir at the time ;-(

But it was much more transparent and easy to understand that the previous system.

The comment someone made earlier about it allowing people to spend their points where they want is the main thing.
It allows people to push/ experiment with what they think works best.
The restrictor pill thing only partially works, you also need to lock down the turbo to a sealed oem and sealed ecu. Then someone will still find a way around. It is amazing what has been tried, like roll cages used as auxiliary fuel tanks.

If you want to actually race, join IPRA or Sedans.
( see other thread)
Inventing you own race class is reinventing the wheel, plus races can only be had on race permitted days at the tracks. They are all taken. You would have to buy a slot at one of them, you would need 20 entrants to afford it. Ask VicV8!

Anyway, if you think doing classes for a one make series is hard come a help me do it for a series with 40 different possibilies


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Im not talking about a race series. Im saying Id like to see a sprint class that brought the cars into line regarding Power to Wieght.

The main issues with this series is no one has any idea what each others cars weigh Or what power they have... Most classes have fairly set ideas like coilovers / full exhaust / flashed or aftermarket ecu's which all add up to place you in a class so that is where the majority of the points come from.... Not how much you weigh & if you are running 27psi... lol. The power & weight thing is what I hear people talking/complaining about, however this is the area no one has any idea on.......?

Pleiades
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby Pleiades » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:22 pm

Look what herbs found,
https://www.facebook.com/STAVTECH/


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h-are
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby h-are » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:35 am

Pleiades wrote:Look what herbs found,
https://www.facebook.com/STAVTECH/


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A face book page?

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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby Pleiades » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:51 am

With lots of legendary tales about how to cheat your category


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h-are
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby h-are » Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:07 am

Well I best start reading then.... lol!

Whether people are cheating or not would be a whole different topic.

More where I am coming from is the mod sheet allows people to build completely different cars that end up in the same class, which I'm sure some people like, however I'm not sold it is the best thing...

Eg. My car was in clubman on 310 points, Leon Smith came 3rd in class for the year in a car on 290 points which would indicate the cars should be fairly evenly matched....?? Leons car would probably be 200kg heavier with roughly the same amount of go (I assume... :loopy: ).... You tell me who is more likely to come out ontop 9 times out of 10, No matter who is driving....

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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby blackrex » Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:20 pm

Having run in a class that requires a restrictor, my answer would be HELL NO. To get good power and drive-ability out of a restricted engine requires a lot of supporting mods, and a built engine.
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h-are
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby h-are » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:24 pm

Ive never run a restrictor but when you say 'good power'... What sort of power are you referring?

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blackrex
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby blackrex » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:52 am

With a 34mm restrictor, around 210kw at the FW
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ls0775
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby ls0775 » Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:38 pm

h-are wrote:Well I best start reading then.... lol!

Whether people are cheating or not would be a whole different topic.

More where I am coming from is the mod sheet allows people to build completely different cars that end up in the same class, which I'm sure some people like, however I'm not sold it is the best thing...

Eg. My car was in clubman on 310 points, Leon Smith came 3rd in class for the year in a car on 290 points which would indicate the cars should be fairly evenly matched....?? Leons car would probably be 200kg heavier with roughly the same amount of go (I assume... :loopy: ).... You tell me who is more likely to come out ontop 9 times out of 10, No matter who is driving....


Haha, probably closer to 300kg heavier as I'm 1505kg kerb and maybe 25KW at the wheels down on power as I was a stock untuned EJ257 with 221KW fly so estimating 165KW at the wheels for an original 9 year with 160000km. I did beat you in round 1 when you did not race. :surrender .

I like and prefer the purity of power to weight classes, however we don't have the cash to do spot dyno checks like the Porsche club. Rules will always disadvantage a part of a group. For me that is the high base points for a 2008+ WRX STI with a fragile EJ257 that always needing short block reinforcement for super sprint reliability not just performance. If I go to the hassle of removing an EJ257, I will always put in non OEM bearings, rods, forged pistons and head studs so it stays together.

But I know all this before starting the season, so no issue from me. Since we are amateurs, I'm thankful we have volunteers in the club willing to put in their own time so we can compete. :thumbs:

Perhaps in 2018 I may just put slicks on and win Open by simply turning up 5 events.
Leon

2008 WRX STI Spec R * 3
Stumpy - 214KW - PI 1:49:8 (R), Sandown 1:26:2 (S), Winton 1:36:7 (R)
Stocky - 165KW - PI 1:53:6 (R), Sandown 1:26:4 (R). Winton 1:38.6 (R)
Scratchy - xxxKW -

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KuRT12
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby KuRT12 » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:31 am

Good points of discussion, whilst we don't dispute the idea of a power/weight or restricted class we just feel that it will be extremely difficult to manage at our level of Motorsport (as Leon stated) and also goes against the "freedom" with how our current rules are allowed competitors to build a car the way they want. Forcing people to meet certain requirements/mods i think will be exclusionary to some competitors. I also think we wouldn't get enough "committed" to run in a dedicated class.

Regardless of this, i still think we have achieved a high level of parity. It is always difficult to compare Car A & Car B, as Driver A & Driver B would make more of a difference in "times" than the modification levels between the cars. I.E. Its not always cars that win classes, and its not always drivers than win classes.

Please also note there has been a small amendment to calendar with Sandown moving one day earlier to Saturday 21st April (in-lieu of Sunday 22nd April)

Also, Leon - you can do that but as per rules you'd need to bolt in a minimum of a half cage in order to be eligible to compete in Open class. ;)
MY '12 SWP WRX STi Spec. R Sedan
Sandown 1:20.48 - Winton 1:35.19 - Wakefield 1:06.84 - Phillip Island 1:44.96 - Broadford 1:03.80 - SMSP Gardner (AD08) : 1:48.05

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KuRT12
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby KuRT12 » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:35 am

Also, i know in the past NSW WRX tried to implement power thresholds for classes (i.e. sub 200kW) but found it was easily manipulated and caused lots of dramas.
They have since adopted our style of mod-sheet and we are both convinced this is the best way forward at our level of motorsport.

If you look at the NSW rules, they are very inline with what we do now as we have been moving toward rule parity with them as a result of SubiNats.
MY '12 SWP WRX STi Spec. R Sedan
Sandown 1:20.48 - Winton 1:35.19 - Wakefield 1:06.84 - Phillip Island 1:44.96 - Broadford 1:03.80 - SMSP Gardner (AD08) : 1:48.05

h-are
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Re: WRX Motorsport 2018

Postby h-are » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:38 pm

All good.

Mod sheet it is then.

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