Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

User avatar
RO323
Silver MY08 WRX Driver
Silver MY08 WRX Driver
Posts: 98
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:14 pm
Location: Melbourne

Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby RO323 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 10:26 am

A little delayed...

I just wanted to express my:

1) Relief that Kyle was fine after the crash. Honestly, working as an Emergency and Trauma Physician, I was expecting a much worse outcome. Kyle, sorry I hugged you after you got out of the car!
2) Appreciation to the Motorsport Team, Medical Team and track support. I was very surprised to be able to get back on the track the same day.
3) Thanks to the two M4 drivers in front of me who ran immediately to Kyle's aid with extinguishers in hand.

And, I did a PB of 1.24.03 to just pip 3 of the 4 M4s!

Rohan
BMW 1M

PI: 1.53.09
Sandown: 1.24.03
Calder Park: 1.07.31
Winton: 1.36.94

Snowy
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Posts: 1350
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 6:59 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula Vic

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Snowy » Tue Nov 08, 2016 5:17 pm

RO323 wrote:A little delayed...

I just wanted to express my:

1) Relief that Kyle was fine after the crash. Honestly, working as an Emergency and Trauma Physician, I was expecting a much worse outcome. Kyle, sorry I hugged you after you got out of the car!
2) Appreciation to the Motorsport Team, Medical Team and track support. I was very surprised to be able to get back on the track the same day.
3) Thanks to the two M4 drivers in front of me who ran immediately to Kyle's aid with extinguishers in hand.

Rohan

Hear hear Rohan, very well said indeed :thumbs:

PS. I'm tipping Kyle couldn't have given a stuff about being hugged by another grown man at that point in time!
Snowy
Vice-President (2014 - current) - vp@wrx.com.au
Former Club Secretary (2012 - 2014)
MY00 WRX Red Mica - 3" CES S/S CBE

h-are
Impreza WRX Driver
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:25 am

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby h-are » Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:47 pm

good post

Cheers boys. Yes I was very lucky indeed (and enjoyed the hug :) ). The guys that ran over to get me out of the car I cant thank enough!

If I had my time again I would go a 6 point cage from the start. However, I will say it was my half cage, 6 point harness, Velo fixed back seat & Hans and helmet that saved me from time in hospital Or worse nervous

I'd actually like to take this opportunity to make something very clear..... My accident was some type of mechanical failure with my brakes (of which I doubt I'll ever find out 100% what it was). I went to press the brake pedal at the end of the straight and the car basically locked me out, brake pedal was rock hard and I proceeded to go straight into the gravel at over 200kmshr. I was not over driving my car, I did not do anything I haven't done at Sandown for the entire time I've been racing.....

I say this for no other reason than wanting to make it VERY clear that this can happen to ANYONE!! Please if you are reading this and you participate in our track days WITHOUT a HANS device (and compatible helmet), a good 4/6 point harness & if possible a roll cage please make it/them your next investment/mod! I left the track at around the 206kmshr mark, rolled at least twice, bounced over the tyre barriers and hit the outside retaining wall which has completely killed my car. However because of the safety device decisions/investments I'd made very early on was home to kiss my 2 boys good night by 6:30pm. The stuff works go and make an investment in yourself, for you and your family.

Now having said all of that the hunt is on for the next car! I'll be back. :boxing:

User avatar
sacar-1
Impreza RS Driver
Posts: 220
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:58 pm
Location: Glen Wav

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby sacar-1 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 9:13 pm

Glad you're ok Kyle,

"I say this for no other reason than wanting to make it VERY clear that this can happen to ANYONE!! Please if you are reading this and you participate in our track days WITHOUT a HANS device (and compatible helmet), a good 4/6 point harness & if possible a roll cage please make it/them your next investment/mod! "

Food for thought
2004 Wrx Sti SE040R (with fresh Forged rebuild)
2002 bug hatch with Sti Conversion

User avatar
KuRT12
Impreza 22B Driver
Posts: 1636
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:14 pm
Location: Eastern Suburbs, Melbourne

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby KuRT12 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 8:17 am

Thanks for wrap up Rohan!

As per Kyles post, i have just invested in a Half Cage - and will have new Helmet/HANS & Harness for my next event. Cant place a price on your safety.
MY '12 SWP WRX STi Spec. R Sedan
Sandown 1:20.48 - Winton 1:35.19 - Wakefield 1:06.84 - Phillip Island 1:44.96 - Broadford 1:03.80 - SMSP Gardner (AD08) : 1:48.05

User avatar
Mr Corduroy
Silver/Blue WRX Driver
Silver/Blue WRX Driver
Posts: 2171
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 10:01 pm
Location: Melbourne - Inner Eastern

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Mr Corduroy » Wed Nov 09, 2016 10:46 am

I have a Hans device, 6 point harness and fixed back Sparco seat.

As a result of this incident I ordered a half cage on Monday.

A couldn't agree more that this is a wake up call to many of us.
Silver MY05 WRX & Blue MY98 WRX

Pleiades
Probationary Driver
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:52 pm
Location: Adelaide

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Pleiades » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:20 am

Buy your HANS Device now, CAMS did have a special.
Now the compulsory use of HANS devices is coming down the levels of motorsport.
It is only a matter of time, before they are at Club Level. It will be soon, apart from personal experience stories like this, the data is irrefutable.
The only thing slowing that down is CAMS are mindfull of not increasing the cost of people starting at grassroots motosport.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

User avatar
bazzasti
Impreza 22B Driver
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 8:26 am

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby bazzasti » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:52 am

I've been in contact with CAMS since my little bingle back in June and have been trying to understand why they aren't forcing safety onto the track owners as they do for us car owners. We can put all the safety gear into our cars and we can drive sensibly and so on but that's not going stop the stacks from happening, it's racing and they will happen and I think we're at a point where local tracks need to account for worst case scenarios (brake fail on main straight) and provide 1st and 2nd line of safety. Unfortunately Australian tracks (except PI and prolly Sydney MSP) are so far behind in terms of safety it's not funny and someone sooner than later won't be as lucky as Kyle or myself.

Pleiades
Probationary Driver
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:52 pm
Location: Adelaide

Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Pleiades » Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:38 pm

The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the Track Safety manual.
http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdf
In theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Last edited by Pleiades on Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.

h-are
Impreza WRX Driver
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:25 am

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby h-are » Wed Nov 09, 2016 2:20 pm

There are alot of should haves and could haves and I absolutely did not do everything correctly but if the car is not touching the ground enough to make an impression on the gravel I dare say it is not slowing you down...... Where I went off the track the ground looked as though it slightly dipped down then started to rise into the gravel. This appears to have unweighted the car and it travelled a good 20 (possibly more) meters into the gravel with out wiping any speed off. Infact Id say, due to the car being unweighted and therefore basically having no rolling risistance I may well have speed up....

Good to hear a few of you stepping up the safety equipment though!

Pleiades
Probationary Driver
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:52 pm
Location: Adelaide

Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Pleiades » Wed Nov 09, 2016 2:27 pm

Now why did that post twice, Can someone delete one
Any how, nice to see you are alright.
I had a look at that trap on Tuesday after your adventure and over last weekend, it does seem to have compacted a bit!
I wonder if stirring it up needs to be added to track safety rules.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

h-are
Impreza WRX Driver
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:25 am

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby h-are » Wed Nov 09, 2016 2:51 pm

I remember seeing the slightest of marks in the gravel. However when Ive been watching the vid I'm sideways very early in the gravel and I dont recall seeing marks that looked like that... So possibly the rear wasnt touching. Anyways, Id prefer to know what happened back at the 120m mark when my pedal wasnt moving.... Unfortunately I doubt I ever will.

User avatar
bazzasti
Impreza 22B Driver
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 8:26 am

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby bazzasti » Wed Nov 09, 2016 3:01 pm

Pleiades wrote:The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the manual.
http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdf
In theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


If CAMs know that gravel traps don't stop a car then they need 5-10 meters of layered tyres or another solution that protects drivers, it's 2016 so I'm sure a engineer can figure something out that works.

The fact is this has happened before in QLD only 3 years ago. The wall was around 79m from the track yet CAMs know that failed to stop the car and a death occurred. At Sandown the wall is around 72 meters from the track.

PI main straight on the other hand has a 55 meter of run off asphalt, 85 meters of gravel and then another 30 meters of asphalt and then 25 meters to a tyre wall - that's 200 meters of run off to sort your car out. FACT is at PI we hit 250+ kph in the main straight, at Sandown we hit 240+ kph... so why is the safety so chalk and cheese? It's simply not acceptable and needs to change before someone loses their life. What happened to Kyle and I could happen to any car and if that car happens to be one with a std seat belt and no cage.....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-05/d ... er/7143550

magoo
Learner Driver
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 3:04 pm

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby magoo » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:28 pm

I ordered a 6 point cage with door bars after the PI round, $1720 is cheap insurance plus it'll look cool..lol. There was a seven week wait so it should be here soon.
Now I need a seat and HANS device.
Glad to see no one was hurt in the incident and the safety gear did what it was meant to do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

neptune11
Impreza WRX Driver
Posts: 463
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2013 4:32 pm
Location: Bayside

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby neptune11 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:30 am

bazzasti wrote:
Pleiades wrote:The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the manual.
http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdf
In theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


If CAMs know that gravel traps don't stop a car then they need 5-10 meters of layered tyres or another solution that protects drivers, it's 2016 so I'm sure a engineer can figure something out that works.

The fact is this has happened before in QLD only 3 years ago. The wall was around 79m from the track yet CAMs know that failed to stop the car and a death occurred. At Sandown the wall is around 72 meters from the track.

PI main straight on the other hand has a 55 meter of run off asphalt, 85 meters of gravel and then another 30 meters of asphalt and then 25 meters to a tyre wall - that's 200 meters of run off to sort your car out. FACT is at PI we hit 250+ kph in the main straight, at Sandown we hit 240+ kph... so why is the safety so chalk and cheese? It's simply not acceptable and needs to change before someone loses their life. What happened to Kyle and I could happen to any car and if that car happens to be one with a std seat belt and no cage.....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-05/d ... er/7143550


PI will always be the safest & has the most run off needed, as it's designed for Moto GP, where it's most certainly needed..
MY 11 WRX Hatch
WRC Blue
#Tuned & Serviced by Got it Rex
#Upgraded parts by Tuspeed
#Steering & Suspension by Trutrack
#Engine rebuild by Top Torque

neptune11
Impreza WRX Driver
Posts: 463
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2013 4:32 pm
Location: Bayside

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby neptune11 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:32 am

May I ask Kurt & Mr Corduroy where you ordered your half cages through?. Will they also installed?
MY 11 WRX Hatch
WRC Blue
#Tuned & Serviced by Got it Rex
#Upgraded parts by Tuspeed
#Steering & Suspension by Trutrack
#Engine rebuild by Top Torque

Pleiades
Probationary Driver
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:52 pm
Location: Adelaide

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Pleiades » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:27 am

I don't think that some people at CAMS know that Gravel traps need stirring up [FLUSHED FACE].

I wonder if the ecu can be interrogated to see if it knows what happened.

PI is interesting, in that they made changes to turn one after a car went straight across and ended up at turn 3 just missing a car. Well known driver as well, he came to WRX Club soon after for a chat. He retired to running a Tyre business for a while.
So they put in a barrier.
Bike GP objected as tyres would kill bike rider.
They took them out.
So a bike rider went straight across and died.

The thing is also PI you might max out at 250, but others go above 300.
The problem is not hitting wall, its hitting other vehicle.

Also cages are not cages, you need to make sure that it isnt made from gas pipe [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

ratty05
Impreza RS Driver
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:23 pm

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby ratty05 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 12:00 pm

I've had a 6pt bolt in cage sitting in the shed since middle of the year, wasn't sure whether to sell or install as my car is basically standard compared to some others out there. After reading this I think I'll get it put in. Gets very minimal daily use so I can put up with it I think.
For those asking where to get them, mine is from AGI in Sydney. Comes with CAMS paperwork just need to take photos of it installed and send it in apparently.

Snowy
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Posts: 1350
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 6:59 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula Vic

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Snowy » Thu Nov 10, 2016 12:12 pm

neptune11 wrote:May I ask Kurt & Mr Corduroy where you ordered your half cages through?. Will they also installed?

Yes please Kurt & Andrew, I would appreciate this information too!!

Very interesting discussion going on here....and being one of our Club members who does get around the track with standard seatbelt & no cage (albeit in Street class with a pretty standard MY00 GC8), it has me re-thinking safety for 2017 nervous

I can understand that installing a half/full cage or even harness bars for those with daily drivers could present a real dilemma - do I give up going on track or potentially stuff up the interior of my road car installing safety gear?!?

With my GC8 not doing daily duties anymore but still very much registered for the road as I love driving it on the road & doing our Club social cruises etc, my decision is more straightforward.
Snowy
Vice-President (2014 - current) - vp@wrx.com.au
Former Club Secretary (2012 - 2014)
MY00 WRX Red Mica - 3" CES S/S CBE

Snowy
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Chocolate Wheels Driver
Posts: 1350
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 6:59 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula Vic

Re: Sandown Wrap Up (29/10/16)

Postby Snowy » Thu Nov 10, 2016 12:29 pm

magoo wrote:I ordered a 6 point cage with door bars after the PI round, $1720 is cheap insurance plus it'll look cool..lol. There was a seven week wait so it should be here soon.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Do you mind telling us where you sourced your cage from? And is it bolt-in or weld-in?
Snowy
Vice-President (2014 - current) - vp@wrx.com.au
Former Club Secretary (2012 - 2014)
MY00 WRX Red Mica - 3" CES S/S CBE

Return to “Public Club Motorsport Discussions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 8 guests