Handbrake turns in a WRX.

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digitalinscription
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Postby digitalinscription » Mon Nov 12, 2007 3:31 pm

wrxbouy wrote:
deafwish wrote:
Darth wrote:
Mr Corduroy wrote:
saff_cossie wrote:Have been doing them for a year in my car (most weekends in the right environment) and I don't seem to have any adverse effects on my car.


I'm not an expert on Mitsubishi's, but I thought that the latest models could handle use of the handbrake more intelligently?

For example, Mazda 6 MPS have an electronically controlled clutch driving the rear wheels, so it can stop all drive to the rear wheels when you put on the handbrake.


I read that MY05 STi's unlock the centre diff when the handbrake is applied.


Cars with DCCD do disengage drive to the front wheels when the park brake is on.
If you lift the handbrake one click (so it doesn't engage the brake), you can even do RWD standstill burnouts!!!! :thumbs:



Is this correct??? can anyone else confirm???


tried it; doesn't work in an MY06 STI, in either auto or manual DCCD operation
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deafwish
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Postby deafwish » Mon Nov 12, 2007 3:55 pm

digitalinscription wrote:
wrxbouy wrote:
deafwish wrote:
Darth wrote:
Mr Corduroy wrote:
saff_cossie wrote:Have been doing them for a year in my car (most weekends in the right environment) and I don't seem to have any adverse effects on my car.


I'm not an expert on Mitsubishi's, but I thought that the latest models could handle use of the handbrake more intelligently?

For example, Mazda 6 MPS have an electronically controlled clutch driving the rear wheels, so it can stop all drive to the rear wheels when you put on the handbrake.


I read that MY05 STi's unlock the centre diff when the handbrake is applied.


Cars with DCCD do disengage drive to the front wheels when the park brake is on.
If you lift the handbrake one click (so it doesn't engage the brake), you can even do RWD standstill burnouts!!!! :thumbs:



Is this correct??? can anyone else confirm???


tried it; doesn't work in an MY06 STI, in either auto or manual DCCD operation


Hmmm.....
American internet forums are generally reliable... :o :clown:
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[WRXTC]
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Postby [WRXTC] » Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:08 pm

lol juz got told that handbraking in an auto kills your transmission?? is that true!!?? :shock:
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digitalinscription
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Postby digitalinscription » Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:21 pm

deafwish wrote:
digitalinscription wrote:
wrxbouy wrote:
deafwish wrote:
Darth wrote:
Mr Corduroy wrote:
saff_cossie wrote:Have been doing them for a year in my car (most weekends in the right environment) and I don't seem to have any adverse effects on my car.


I'm not an expert on Mitsubishi's, but I thought that the latest models could handle use of the handbrake more intelligently?

For example, Mazda 6 MPS have an electronically controlled clutch driving the rear wheels, so it can stop all drive to the rear wheels when you put on the handbrake.


I read that MY05 STi's unlock the centre diff when the handbrake is applied.


Cars with DCCD do disengage drive to the front wheels when the park brake is on.
If you lift the handbrake one click (so it doesn't engage the brake), you can even do RWD standstill burnouts!!!! :thumbs:



Is this correct??? can anyone else confirm???


tried it; doesn't work in an MY06 STI, in either auto or manual DCCD operation


Hmmm.....
American internet forums are generally reliable... :o :clown:


maybe so, but my handbrake, DCCD and a certain muddy paddock say otherwise :) :whistle:
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Postby digitalinscription » Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:23 pm

[WRXTC] wrote:lol juz got told that handbraking in an auto kills your transmission?? is that true!!?? :shock:


dunno about that, but I used to do handbraking in my Magna every so often and there was no problem... but that was FWD only, soooo :?
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Electra1STi
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DCCD standstill burnouts

Postby Electra1STi » Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:29 pm

Digital Insertion wrote: tried it; doesn't work in an MY06 STI, in either auto or manual DCCD operation...
... maybe so, but my handbrake, DCCD and a certain muddy paddock say otherwise

Hey "Digi-Insertion" :giggle:
You're not trying hard enough mate! ;D

You may be having trouble because your MY'06 STi DCCD has a 41:59 Front:Rear static mechanical torque split, whereas previous MY'05 & prior STis were 35:65 F:R. But even so, the DCCD controller WILL disengage the centre differential clutch packs (i.e. zero lock) when the hand brake switch is triggered on, regardless whether you’re in Manual or Auto mode.

Daz is right about the ‘lift the handbrake 1 click trick’, although technically it doesn’t disengage drive to the front wheels; it just applies no LSD lock-up on the centre axle (thru the c-diff) which allows the c-diff to slip, hence no Limited-Slip effect.

I think you’re just forgetting that to do standstills in a DCCD-equipped car, you need to be pressing the (foot) brake just enough to lock the front axle! :thumbs:
(and preferably have a slight difference in traction b/t F:R if you want to minimise strain your drive line, i.e. less grip at rear tyres/surface)

Unlike an LSD (e.g. when DCCD is in Auto or any locked %), DCCD in “Free” mode will still allow a huge rotational-speed difference between front & rear axles - that includes zero rotation at front while spinning the rears. In DCCD “Free” mode, the C-diff operates similar to an open diff, so yes you can definitely do standstills - you just have to get the technique right. ;D ... not that I condone such hoonish behaviour, ahem :whistle:
... or just fit some foolly-siiick RWD fuses mate! :lol:

You’ve seen the footage (Daz’s youtube link) & I speak from experience... I’ve disconnected the DCCD control unit altogether (to diagnose electronic faults) on my MY'98 STi v.4 Type RA (same technology in principle without the STi v.8-9’s Auto mode & it’s fancy lateral-G/yaw sensors, steering angle sensors, TPS, ABS interface, etc.) which leaves the DCCD permanently in “Free” mode (no electrical current through the DCCD electromagnetic coil means zero lock) so it makes my car behave seemingly RWD at WOT.

Anyway, I’m getting da hell outta here before Age starts flogging the RWD fuses again! :lol:
RWD fuses FTW! :first: :thumbs:
Last edited by Electra1STi on Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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deafwish
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Postby deafwish » Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:27 pm

^^^ Yeh!
That's what I was going to say! :whistle: :clown:
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Postby joelstrick » Sun Jan 20, 2008 1:50 am

I think a wet skid pan or another paddock bash to help fix this question
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ABCxyz
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Re: Handbrake turns in a WRX.

Postby ABCxyz » Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:20 pm

Darth wrote:Q. Are handbrake turns bad for the diffs in a rex? Would a motorkhana at DECA cause any damage from using the handbrake?


It depends on what car you have.

Reading the posts it would seem you have a MY06 STi ??????????? Most of the information is right or close to right. This is how it actually works.

If you have an MY06 STi you have a LSD front rear and centre. On top of that you have an electrically controlled clutch pack in the centre diff (DCCD) which can be engaged partly to provide a varying degree of lock dependant on the current provided to the coils in the diff. Contrary to written info it can not provide 100% lock at high levels of torque differential.

If you apply your handbrake the DCCD controller will override all other inputs and remove all power to the centre diff. If all power is removed the centre diff it will still act as a LSD but with no additional lock assistance. In other words if there is a difference in speed from the front axel to back axel the centre diff will try to make them spin at the same speed. When it can’t do this (handbrake on) it creates heat and causes some wear. For short lock ups for handbrake turns this isn't a big issue. It will try to stop the rears from locking. Continuous use is not good or if this is your chosen sport you may need to replace your centre diff at some stage.

This all applies regardless of the state you select on the DCCD controller i.e. Auto or Manual.

If you have a MY05 STi you don't have a LSD centre and you will not be doing much harm by using the handbrake. The DCCD control acts the same as above except the Centre Diff (mechanically) is an open diff with a 65R/35F torque. It has the DCCD electrical control to apply lock.

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Postby digitalinscription » Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:51 pm

hrmmm... definately some food for thought... the way my car acted certainly sounds like what ABCxyz is described. Considering that stand-stills aren't my usual sport of choice, I'm probably not going to go trying to prove it :whistle:

What are your thoughts on the 06 now Z :P Could you cope without that capability? :)
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Re: Handbrake turns in a WRX.

Postby Mitch-05STI » Sun Jun 15, 2008 10:54 pm

So just say you happen to have a 05 sti, and you put the hand brake on 1 click, rev'd it up and dropped the clutch :whistle: would just the back wheels spin??

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